EPA FAIL – RESIT – PASS

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This topic contains 14 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  LisaM 11 months, 2 weeks ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 15 total)
  • Author
    Posts

  • GaynorLF
    Participant

    Hi

    We have a learner who has failed their first EPA 22/07/19, then gone on to resit the EPA 19/08/19, for which they achieved a Pass.

    Should I have returned on the ILR R12 as:
    Learning actual end date: 22/07/19
    Completion status: 2 (completed learning activities)
    Outcome: 3 (no achievement)

    Should I then update the ILR for R01 by just amending the Outcome to 1 (achieved)?

    Does the ILR not allow input for fails and subsequent resits?

     
    #396455

    GaynorLF
    Participant

    How is anyone else inputting this please?

    There was no further learning required – purely a resit of the EPA….

     
    #396583

    steveh
    Participant

    I think you just change the 3 to a 1 in your R13.

    However, I cannot point to Official Guidance that actually says this…

     
    #396603

    GaynorLF
    Participant

    Thanks Steve

    I have a query in with Service desk but, to be honest, that doesn’t fill me with confidence for a correct, specific reply.

     
    #396607

    KateW
    Participant

    Hi Gaynor,

    Did you get a response? I have the exact same issue.

    Kind regards,
    Kate

     
    #400582

    Carrie H
    Participant

    I’d like to understand this too if you get a response.
    Thanks

     
    #400604

    kat_curran
    Participant

    Hi Gaynor

    We had the same situation and that’s what we did. Seems to have gone through OK and we got the payments we were eventually expecting.

    Kat

     
    #400680

    LisaM
    Participant

    Hi All

    I am having the same issue, we have a learner who sat and failed EPA in June last year, and is currently coded as a 2 & 3 on the ILR.
    She has resat and we received her result this week and she has passed 🙂

    As the resit is in the new academic year, can anyone advise how we code the ILR to reflect this? No extra training has been given.

    Do we treat it the same as in 18/19 academic year, or how we would process in 19/20?

    Many Thanks
    Lisa

     
    #406081

    ScottP
    Participant

    My view based on the rules is that if the learner is still in EPA then they haven’t completed all their elements of their Apprenticeship. In your example in 18/19 the are Completion = 1. Only until they leave do you know their outcome status. In your example they will be an achiever in 19/20.

     
    #406592

    LisaM
    Participant

    Hi Scott

    Yes the learner completed all of their learning activities in 18/19 failed EPA, and then resat and passed in 19/20.

    I am just a bit confused on how to proceed with the rules changing for how we process them now.

    Should I just leave her as completed non achieved in the R14 ILR and then update her R3 to show the end of the practical period date, and then her achievement date? I feel the guidance does not help clarify what we should do in this situations.

    Many Thanks
    Lisa

     
    #406596

    ScottP
    Participant

    Hi Lisa

    IN my view, the rules haven’t changed as such, just how we have to record them. You should only record an outcome for a learner once they have finished their apprenticeship (i.e. an achiever or a non-achiever). In 18/19 you get the 20% completion payment once ‘all elements of the apprenticeship are complete, including all EPA elements. For your learner, they haven’t completed all their elements in 18/19. They had attempted them all, but as they were continuing with resits, there is further EPA activity going into 19/20.

    If you set the learner in 18/19 as Complete but Not Achieved, you’ll get your 20% payment but the learner will show as a leaver non achiever in success rates. You need to showing them as still on programme (completion status 1) in 18/19.

    In 19/20 the method to record is different, the payment is different, but the rules are the same – you only record an outcome once the learner finishes their apprenticeship. In the ILR in 19/20, the completion date is now the ‘training end date‘ or ‘gateway date‘, and the achievement date is now the ‘apprenticeship end date‘. You now only get the 20% payment if the outcome is achieved.

    Happy to be corrected if anyone knows otherwise.

     

    #406599

    KateW
    Participant

    I’ve been given the below information from the data service this morning (in reference to a learner who failed in 18/19 and will be re-sitting in 19/20):

    ‘I have confirmed with the ILR team that you only record the first attempt on the ILR and do not change it – regardless if the resit is in the same academic year or not.

    If a learners needs additional learning in order to pass the assessment, then a new learning aim should be recorded as a restart with a Funding adjustment for prior learning to account for the new learning required to pass the resit.’

    Hope this helps!

     
    #406614

    GaynorLF
    Participant

    Hi Guys
    Here is the response I got from the Service Desk. Hope it helps.

    My Question
    We have a learner who has failed their first EPA 22/07/19, then gone on to resit the EPA 19/08/19, for which they achieved a Pass. No further learning was required, just a resit of the EPA.
    ESFA response
    In this caseyou should only mark the apprentice as completed once – using the 18/19 rules, as the apprenticeship training was completed before 1st Aug 2019.
    For apprenticeship Standards, where the learner has completed all learning activities and began the End point assessment period prior to 1st August 2019, the Learning Actual End date for the current year will continue to include the end point assessment.
    So, for apprenticeship Standards where the training has ended before 1st Aug 2019, and the assessment is after the 1st Aug 2019, the 18/19 rules apply and the Achievement date is not returned – only the Learning Actual end date:
    Completion Status – 2
    Learning actual end date – end of EPA (in which the learner passed)
    Outcome – 1

    Thank you for contacting the ESFA Service Centre
    Best Regards
    Michael Smith (Education and Skills Funding Agency)

     
    #406653

    ScottP
    Participant

    Thanks for the further info, so key is whether the learner has a period of retraining (for which you will require evidence). No retraining – continuation of programme. Retraining occurred – close off the Zprog and restart a new one.

     
    #406671

    LisaM
    Participant

    Hi All

    Thanks for the above, this does help. I know what to do now 🙂

    Many Thanks
    Lisa

     
    #406678
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