ERN validation

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This topic contains 13 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  Sue Bishop 1 month ago.

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  • Ceribland
    Participant

    We recently tried to search an ERN number that we had previously found on the EDRS site and it returned no results.
    EDRS explained that ERNs beginning with 1 or 2 have been externally verified and need to be validated every 6 months or they are removed from their records. The process of validation changes the number to one starting with 9 (which indicates internal verification apparently).
    We have been instructed to validate every employer they use if the ERN on their record starts with 1 or 2. As we did not realise this until now, over half of our current apprentices have ERNs that are no longer valid. Validating them all now seems a huge endeavour- especially as they are being really picky in terms of the employees on site numbers. EDRS also seem reluctant to approach employers for confirmation given the Covid situation.
    Has anyone else been verifying ERNs that start with 1 and 2?
    Ceri

     
    #447148

    Sue Bishop
    Participant

    No, but I noticed that some had changed and started looking into it. I asked the service desk what the implications were if I needed to change an EDRS number, and they stated ‘none’, that we could just change them if necessary and there would be no error/warning.

    My only issue with changing it is that the learner record on any EPAO portal also needs changing, as well as CRM systems so part of me thinks that since there is no ILR validation of the EDRS then why even bother?

    It’s OK if you only have a few employers, but if you don’t……..

     
    #447158

    Jaci
    Participant

    Wow. Seriously!

    We have problem getting them verified when we have a discrepancy in number of employees as it is and often get the automated response saying they have tried to contact the employer but have been unsuccessful and resubmit again. Which is very strange as our employers always pick up when we call! But, we have now given up even trying and just accept in on the data mismatch report.

     
    #447160

    Sue Bishop
    Participant

    Jaci do you just leave the generic 99999…. on your ILR?

    Just curious…..:)

    Sue

     
    #447166

    Jaci
    Participant

    Hi Sue, No we put the actual number in

     
    #447186

    robS4S
    Participant

    the 9999999 only works for three months(from the start of programme) before the validation rules will no longer accept uploaded ILR records with it.

     
    #447280

    Sue Bishop
    Participant

    That’s my understanding too, Rob, but I know that they are re-validating some and so there would be a difference in what is on EDRS portal and what is on the ILR. If there is no ERN validation from the ILR, you could in theory put any old nine digit number in!

    Sue

     
    #447284

    Ceribland
    Participant

    UPDATE
    We have since been informed that an update to the EDRS system has made loads of ERNs invalid. We’re working with the EDRS to validate the ones that we have identified.
    It is a slow process of reading out the 300+ invalid numbers to them over the phone. They are looking into a quicker way.
    They said that numbers beginning with 3 will always need to be verified as they are duplicates. Other ERNs should be verified before use if the last verification was over 6 months ago.

     
    #447287

    Sue Bishop
    Participant

    Like we haven’t got enough to do……

     
    #447290

    Judy M
    Participant

    Apologies this is slightly at a tangent to the original post – but can anyone help me assist a new employer to find their ERN? They seem unable to locate it on the Apprenticeship Service -is it there and if so, could anyone offer me specific directions please!

    Many thanks, Judy

     
    #447298

    Sue Bishop
    Participant

    They won’t find it on the AS Judy. It’s not usual for the employer to obtain this number, it is the provider who does so – from the link below:

    https://edrs.education.gov.uk/search/lsc/

    I’m wondering (if they are on the AS and looking for a number) whether they are looking for their HMRC Gateway number and not the ERN after all?

    Sue

     
    #447300

    robS4S
    Participant

    the employer should not have access to the https://edrs.education.gov.uk/ but you can use their Companies house number in the CRO field. Or follow the instructions to get a new one created. https://edrs.education.gov.uk/search/lsc/add.aspx they will contact the employer directly and get the record created.

     
    #447302

    Judy M
    Participant

    Thanks Sue and Rob, that’s really helpful.

    Thanks!

     
    #447304

    Sue Bishop
    Participant

    Do you know what, Rob, I never knew that about the CRO number – thanks for that tip – every day’s a school day, eh?

    Sue

     
    #447306
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