Learner Eligibility Opinions

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This topic contains 8 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by  Martin West 5 years, 5 months ago.

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  • AuditFE
    Participant

    I was hoping to gain your opinions on the following:

    One of my clients has been approached regarding the taking on of 3 apprentices by a business owner. The business owner would also like to undertake a management L3 Apprenticeship as in taking on the potential 3 apprentices, this would be her first experience of managing people. As the business owner, who is a co-owner of the business, would probably be considered self employed, and self employed people (other than those in exempted professions) are not eligible for an apprenticeship. In my opinion this would make the business owner ineligible, as it would seem she is self-employed, however, as the business owner is a co-owner only and the other co-owner is her mentor, and have stated that they will provide on the job training to the co-owner, would it be possible for her to undertake the apprenticeship. I just want to gain other people’s opinions on this to ensure that I advise them appropriately as it is an unusual one.

    What are your views on this?

    Thanks in anticipation.

     
    #6311

    AuditFE
    Participant

    Apologies for the duplicate post. My system crashed during the original post so I was unsure as to whether it had gone through.

     
    #6313

    Martin West
    Participant

    It all comes down to if the person is employed by the business, when a self-employed person takes on their first employee they are both employed by the business and classed as employees even though the business owner may still consider themselves to be self-employed.
    This is typical in Agriculture where a farmer may employ a family member and as long as you can obtain an EDRS number it is not an issue.

     
    #6315

    AuditFE
    Participant

    Thanks Martin, much appreciated.

     
    #6316

    maria
    Participant

    I tend to refer to the attached website when I am unsure & of course as long they have a contract of employment as per the funding rules page 29 in the box at the top of the page.
    “The term ‘employed’ is defined as an individual who has a ‘contract of employment’. This does not include individuals who are self-employed.”

     
    #6317

    maria
    Participant

    sorry forgot to give the web address
    https://www.gov.uk/employment-status/selfemployed-contractor

     
    #6318

    AuditFE
    Participant

    Thanks Maria. That is great.

     
    #6319

    AuditFE
    Participant

    Hi Martin

    Have queried this with SFA and they are of the opinion I was that the business owner would not be eligible for an apprenticeship as they are a co-owner of the business and are therefore self employed. They EDRS does not come into it apparently.

    Thanks for your advice anyway.

     
    #6338

    Martin West
    Participant

    I would have to query the assumption that a business co-owner must be self –employed as they can and often do have an operation role (occupation) within the business.
    I would agree that where a business owner has no operation role within the business they cannot be classed as employed but where they have a role they are an employee of the business.

    As you have said that a master servant relationship will exist between the co-owners and that it is for a management role I would say that this makes them eligibility to undertake an Apprenticeship.

    Yes they will need to formalise this with job roles, contract of employment and Apprenticeship agreement but where someone regards themselves as self-employed for tax purposes this does not mean that they are not an employee for employment rights purposes in which case they would be eligible to undertake an Apprenticeship.

    As always each case is individual but in this case the co-owner should be eligible but funding eligibility is another matter.

     
    #6369
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