Minimum duration vs Actual Duration – Apprentices

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This topic contains 10 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  mike_1304 5 years, 4 months ago.

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  • lapsed_user
    Participant

    Hi,

    If a learner who has a planned duration of less than 366 days and there was no RPL applied (19+ learner), but stays on programme for 16-18 months, can they achieve their framework?

    Also, if the learner was 16-18 and had a planned duration of less than 366 days but stayed on programme for longer than 366 days, can they achieve their framework?

    Thanks in advance,

    Mel

     
    #11987

    Martin West
    Participant

    Hi Mel,
    The funding rules indicate no in the following:
    137. Apprenticeship learning is not eligible to be funded if the planned duration of the framework, calculated from the learning start date and the learning planned end date, is less than one year. If the exception described at paragraph 135 above applies, the planned duration of the
    framework must be at least six months.
    But see also 133 as a longer period may apply
    133. The minimum duration of all Apprenticeships is one year. To meet this condition, the apprentice must still be in learning on the anniversary of the date they started the Apprenticeship. If the Specification for Apprenticeship Standards in England (SASE) Framework states a longer duration, that longer duration will apply and must be substituted in the funding rules for the minimum duration of Apprenticeships.

    In practice as long as the minimum duration is achieved as outlined above and the original planned end date was entered in error but you were not able to correct this due to the rules over not altering end dates then this should be ok.
    HTH

     
    #11990

    Mimido
    Participant

    Sorry about my interjecting query….What happens if the learner has already achieved a grade A*-C in GCSE/Functional skills level 2 in Maths and English before the start of the Apprenticeship programme? Would the the 366 minimum duration requirement apply?

     
    #12005

    Hughes18
    Participant

    The minimum duration is applied to the NVQ/Diploma and therefore concession evidence is not reason enough to reduce the duration. To enable a reduction the learner must be 19+ and have significant prior learning that is applied to the delivery aim and you also reduce the funding rate to reflect this.
    Regards
    Tracey

     
    #12026

    lapsed_user
    Participant

    Thanks Martin. It was as I suspected.

     
    #12129

    Mimido
    Participant

    Thanks Mr. Hughes.

     
    #12139

    mike_1304
    Participant

    Hi,

    I would just like to re-ignite this topic.

    Mr Hughes – I would disagree the minimum duration is against the NVQ/Diploma and suggest it is against the Programme Aim. The NVQ/Diploma part can be delivered during any point of the app framework, within reason of GLH, etc.

    My reason to challenge this is I have a learner who achieved within 366 days but had already completed the FS elements – so would this be classed as RPL? in my eyes it would however, is there a difference if the learner had completed the FS previously, or if they had GCSE exemption?

    As with everyone, I want to do what is right, but also I would like to push this learner through as a FW achiever.

    Thoughts?

    Thanks
    Michael

     
    #13609

    Martin West
    Participant

    Hi Michael,
    The answer to your query may be simpler than you think as if the learner has remained in employment under their Apprenticeship agreement with their employer for the 366 days then you can claim completion after the anniversary date.
    I would see this as your only option as I agree with @hughes18 that the framework minimum applies to the workplace content with the employer.
    HTH

     
    #13627

    mike_1304
    Participant

    Hi,

    Thanks for the reply.

    Yes, under normal practice we leave the learner live till 366 days then action to close with some final learning. however this didn’t happen and the FW Cert from ACE has been received where both the ace application and the FW certificate has dates within 366 days.

    Unless we re-apply for the FW? is that possible?

     
    #13631

    Martin West
    Participant

    Hi Michael,
    A bit surprised by your ‘normal practice’ as this would normally be considered an exception and as you have closed the aim that relates to learning with the employer and have already received the completion certificate I think you will have to take a hit on this but view it as a lesson learned.

     
    #13632

    mike_1304
    Participant

    Hi Martin,

    Thanks, yes I think we will have to take the hit.

    re ‘normal practice’ – by keeping the learner live I mean delivery for 366 days as per the rules. this learner who achieved early is a one off.

     
    #13646
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