Q&A on Submit Learner Data and FIS

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This topic contains 158 replies, has 34 voices, and was last updated by  ESFA Data Collections Team 3 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • SFA STAFF

    The new Submit Learner Data service replaces the Hub for learner data returns for the 2019 to 2020 academic year onward.

    To coincide with R01 of 2019 to 2020, the team behind the service is hosting a Q&A thread on this forum from now until 4:00pm on Tuesday 27 August.

    We invite you to put your questions about Submit Learner Data or the new edition of the Funding Information System (FIS), which will also be released tomorrow, to them.

    Feel free to also send any feedback you have – good, bad or ugly – so we can make improvements.

    We look forward to hearing from you.

    Update – 23 August at 1:55pm

    As you may have noticed, the apprenticeship datamatch report for levy funded apprentices is still unavailable for 2019/20 ILR submissions through Submit Learner Data.

    Please be assured this will not impact the accuracy of payments for these apprentices.

    For apprentices who started before August 2019, the report continues to be available if you submit a 2018/19 funding year ILR. Providers are encouraged to use this to check and resolve data locks for these apprentices ahead of R14.

    You should also ensure the data submitted for new apprentices starting in the 2019/20 funding year matches the information agreed with employers in the apprenticeship service.

    As soon as the datamatch report is available, we’ll issue an update using the normal communication channels including FE Connect, @ESFAdigital on Twitter, and on the Submit Learner Data service.

    We’ll supply a further update at midday on the 27th August.

    Update – 22 August at 2:00pm

    FIS is available to download now. It’s currently unsigned, which means you may get a warning along the lines of ‘Windows protected your PC’. Select the ‘More info’ link and select the ‘Run anyway’ button. It’s perfectly safe… I promise!

    Update – 22 August

    A quick update to let you know we’ll be opening for R01 submissions at 9:00am today. FIS will be available by lunchtime. FileMerge (the amalgamation tool) will be available early next week.

    We’ve found some last-minute issues with the Datamatch report (FM36), so we’re afraid it won’t be available straight away.

    We’re working hard to make it available by lunchtime on Tuesday.

    We’re sorry for the inconvenience and will update you as soon as we can.

    Update – 27 August

    Update at 12pm Tuesday – The apprenticeship datamatch report is still not available. We have identified the cause and we are working to resolve this as quickly as possible so we can restore this report for 2019/20 ILR submissions. Once restored you will need to re-submit any R01 ILR files already submitted to ensure the data matches to the apprenticeship service are correct. As we advised in the previous update please be assured this will not affect apprenticeship payments. Please continue to use the 2018/19 datamatch report to check apprentices continuing in 2019/20 are valid, and ensure data for apprentices starting after 1 August 2019 matches the agreement you have recorded with employers in the apprenticeship service.

    We will supply a further update at midday on the 28th August.

     
    #390688

    Martin West
    Participant

    Q1. Will you be producing documentation prior to R01 opening for the new:
    Funding Information Service (FIS) – the desktop tool that checks your files against the 2019 to 2020 validation rules and generates 8 provisional reports (we’ll confirm the full functionality of FIS in the next edition of ESFA Update)
    Amalgamation tool – now called ‘ILR FileMerge’

    Q2. Will FIS output an mdb file in the same format as 2018/19

    Q3. As there as still outstanding issues at R12 with reporting from both the HUB and SLD how confident are you the reporting from the SLD will be correct for R01.

     
    #390694
    SFA STAFF

    Q1. Will you be producing documentation prior to R01 opening for the new:
    Funding Information Service (FIS) – the desktop tool that checks your files against the 2019 to 2020 validation rules and generates 8 provisional reports (we’ll confirm the full functionality of FIS in the next edition of ESFA Update)
    Amalgamation tool – now called ‘ILR FileMerge’

    Q2. Will FIS output an mdb file in the same format as 2018/19

    Q3. As there as still outstanding issues at R12 with reporting from both the HUB and SLD how confident are you the reporting from the SLD will be correct for R01.

    Response from the ESFA

    Hi Martin,

    Thanks for your questions. I’ll answer each of them in turn:

    1. The guidance will be available tomorrow – we’ll release it at the same time as releasing FIS and ILR FileMerge (formerly the amalgamation tool) for 2019 to 2020.

    2. We know the mdb file is important and while it won’t be available tomorrow, we are working on it and it will be part of a future release when it’s ready.

    3. The dual running of Submit Learner Data and the Hub in 2018 to 2019 has meant we’ve been able to identify and fix many of the issues for Submit Learner Data for launch. So we’re very confident that reporting will be correct. If anyone experiences any issues though, please report to Service Desk and the team is on-hand to look into them.

     
    #390732

    Martin West
    Participant

    Thank you for the response to my previous questions.

    Q4: With regard to Q/A 2: I have noticed from the 19/20 EAS guidance that there are changes to the funding lines with 4 changes and 4 additions and I assume this will be replicated in the mdb output file (when available) and the SQL data, is this correct.

     
    #390740
    SFA STAFF

    Q4: With regard to Q/A 2: I have noticed from the 19/20 EAS guidance that there are changes to the funding lines with 4 changes and 4 additions and I assume this will be replicated in the mdb output file (when available) and the SQL data, is this correct.

    Reply from the ESFA

    You’re spot on, Martin.

    As it stands, EAS isn’t included in FIS. The changes to the funding lines will be taken into account though. So the mdb output file and SQL data will be correct.

     
    #390753

    Emma M
    Participant

    Where will data match reporting be stored on SLD? I’ve only been able to access this reporting on the Hub.

     
    #390807

    Martin Locock
    Participant

    1. when will the Learner Entry tool for 19/20 be available ?
    2. when will the ILR submission page be updated to include the link to the tool
    3. will the ILR learner Entry Tool webpage be updated with the 19/20 download link?

     
    #390809

    mike.felton
    Participant

    Hi,

    I have just had a new desktop PC running Windows 10 and we are having major issues getting FIS uploaded onto the PC.

    The ESFA say there is a fix for this issue can anyone help with this as I can’t complete the Maytas upgrade for our MIS system without importing the latest FIS.

    Regards

    Michael

     
    #390812

    Richard Phipps
    Participant

    With regard to:
    3. The dual running of Submit Learner Data and the Hub in 2018 to 2019 has meant we’ve been able to identify and fix many of the issues for Submit Learner Data for launch. So we’re very confident that reporting will be correct. If anyone experiences any issues though, please report to Service Desk and the team is on-hand to look into them.

    I reported two errors to the Service Desk on Thursday and haven’t yet had a reply. So there was still a difference between the two systems as of last week:

    “The LearnDelFAMType_62 errors should be a Warning (according to the ILR_Validation_Rules_2018_19_Version_4 spreadsheet), and I think the ULN_05 errors are incorrect.”

     
    #390815

    Richard Phipps
    Participant

    Can the new FIS just do error checking and not the funding calculations? (which on the old FIS program cause it to take much longer to complete)

     
    #390819

    Martin West
    Participant

    With regard to A4: the funding lines reported in the EAS and SQL server from FIS beta are not the same:
    2918-19 ‘19+ Apprenticeship (From May 2017) Levy Contract’ is on 2019-20 EAS as ‘19+ Apprenticeship (Employer on App Service) Levy funding’ but on FIS beta as ‘19+ Apprenticeship (Employer on App Service)’

     
    #390827

    firozapatten
    Participant

    Hi

    1. The summary of errors pdf file is very useful, can we please have that?
    2. On the current hub the main occupancy report for Total funding match the adult funding claim amount but on the New HUB it doesn’t
    3. Also we use the mdb from the FIS to populate ProAchieve.
    With the Old HUB the total adult funding amount matches the ProAchieve total but now with the new HUB the Proachieve total does not match the adult funding total which also doesnt match the main occupancy report. Why?

    Thanks Firoza

     
    #390836

    robS4S
    Participant

    Number one concern is lack of Data Mismatch report.

    When we started using the SLD we assumed the lack of the report meant “no records” this then caused us to lose money as we were unaware there was any issues.

     
    • This reply was modified 3 months, 3 weeks ago by  robS4S. Reason: fixed typo
    #390847

    Will the funding reports for apprenticeships from FIS match the funding reports from SLD this year? And I echo the other comments regarding the MDB file as this is essential for us to create funding reports as well as for ProAchieve.

     
    #390851

    GaynorLF
    Participant

    Despite my best efforts I am unable to download FIS. It is absolutely necessary to use it or am I OK to submit my PICS prepared file without FIS?

     
    #390855
    SFA STAFF

    Where will data match reporting be stored on SLD? I’ve only been able to access this reporting on the Hub.

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi there,

    This will be in the zip file of reports you receive after you submit.

    Update from the ESFA – 22 August

    We’ve found some last-minute issues with the Datamatch report (FM36), so we’re afraid it won’t be available straight away.

    We’re working hard to make it available by lunchtime on Tuesday. Sorry for the inconvenience – we’ll update you as soon as we can.

     
    #390857

    TerryFord
    Participant

    Martin asked the question:

    Q2. Will FIS output an mdb file in the same format as 2018/19

    The ESFA responded:

    2. We know the mdb file is important and while it won’t be available tomorrow, we are working on it and it will be part of a future release when it’s ready.

    Does the ESFA have an estimated timeline for this “future release” ie next week, next month, next year?

    The FIS .mdb file is vital for us to pay our subcontractors

    Thanks

     
    #390859
    SFA STAFF

    1. when will the Learner Entry tool for 19/20 be available ?
    2. when will the ILR submission page be updated to include the link to the tool
    3. will the ILR learner Entry Tool webpage be updated with the 19/20 download link?

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi Martin,

    It all happens tomorrow. The link to the tool will be available on the Submit Learner Data sign in page, but we have plans to include it on the page after you sign in too, at a later stage.

    A new Learner Entry Tool web page will be available in Submit Learner Data too and the 19/20 link will be on it. We won’t be adding it to the Hub.

     
    #390861
    SFA STAFF

    Hi,

    I have just had a new desktop PC running Windows 10 and we are having major issues getting FIS uploaded onto the PC.

    The ESFA say there is a fix for this issue can anyone help with this as I can’t complete the Maytas upgrade for our MIS system without importing the latest FIS.

    Regards

    Michael

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi Michael,

    Sorry you’re having issues. We’ve tested FIS for 2019/20 thoroughly and it works with Windows 10.

    If you’re experiencing problems with 18/19 FIS, please contact Maytas and they should be able to help you.

     
    #390863
    SFA STAFF

    With regard to:
    3. The dual running of Submit Learner Data and the Hub in 2018 to 2019 has meant we’ve been able to identify and fix many of the issues for Submit Learner Data for launch. So we’re very confident that reporting will be correct. If anyone experiences any issues though, please report to Service Desk and the team is on-hand to look into them.

    I reported two errors to the Service Desk on Thursday and haven’t yet had a reply. So there was still a difference between the two systems as of last week:

    “The LearnDelFAMType_62 errors should be a Warning (according to the ILR_Validation_Rules_2018_19_Version_4 spreadsheet), and I think the ULN_05 errors are incorrect.”

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi Richard,

    It is likely you’ll see errors when comparing reports between the Hub and SLD for 2018/19 reports. This is because our focus has been on fixing issues for 2019/20 so we can be ready for R01. We haven’t necessarily made the changes for 2018/19. So for 18/19, the reports in the Hub are your true reports.

     
    #390865
    SFA STAFF

    With regard to A4: the funding lines reported in the EAS and SQL server from FIS beta are not the same:
    2918-19 ‘19+ Apprenticeship (From May 2017) Levy Contract’ is on 2019-20 EAS as ‘19+ Apprenticeship (Employer on App Service) Levy funding’ but on FIS beta as ‘19+ Apprenticeship (Employer on App Service)’

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi Martin,

    I understand what you’re getting at now.

    The new and changed apprenticeship funding lines are an exception to this. There is extra information on the apprenticeship service, which FIS does not hold, to determine whether an employer on the apprenticeship service is levy or non-levy. So in your FIS reports, these funding lines will not distinguish between your levy learners on the service and your non-levy learners on the service, instead the funding lines will appear as follows:

    16-18 Apprenticeship (Employer on App Service)
    Adult Apprenticeship (Employer on App Service)

     
    #390867
    SFA STAFF

    Can the new FIS just do error checking and not the funding calculations? (which on the old FIS program cause it to take much longer to complete)

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi Richard,

    We’ve streamlined FIS for 19/20 and, as such, it runs much more quickly now – so hopefully you’ll be pleasantly surprised. Let us know how you get on tomorrow.

     
    #390869
    SFA STAFF

    Hi

    1. The summary of errors pdf file is very useful, can we please have that?
    2. On the current hub the main occupancy report for Total funding match the adult funding claim amount but on the New HUB it doesn’t
    3. Also we use the mdb from the FIS to populate ProAchieve.
    With the Old HUB the total adult funding amount matches the ProAchieve total but now with the new HUB the Proachieve total does not match the adult funding total which also doesnt match the main occupancy report. Why?

    Thanks Firoza

    Reply from the ESFA

    Thanks for the questions/feedback, Firoza.

    1. We’ve had a few requests for this, so you’ll be pleased to know it’s in the pipeline to explore. It may be that it’s a different format as we’re striving to be more accessible as an agency, but be assured, we’re working on bringing it back.

    2 and 3: The answers to your other questions effectively boil down to the same thing – that we’ve been focused on 19/20 so we’re ready for R01. This means when we’ve spotted an error in Submit Learner Data, we’ve focused on making it right for 2019/20 – and haven’t necessarily addressed it in Submit Learner Data for 18/19. So (fingers crossed) it should all come together for 2019/20. If it doesn’t though, and you still see issues, please get in touch with Service Desk and we’ll investigate it further.

     
    #390873
    SFA STAFF

    Number one concern is lack of Data Mismatch report.

    When we started using the SLD we assumed the lack of the report meant “no records” this then caused us to lose money as we were unaware there was any issues.

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi Rob,

    Sorry for the confusion while we ran Submit Learner Data alongside the Hub.

    The Data Match report will be available in Submit Learner Data from tomorrow – you’ll find it in the reports you get after you submit (in the zip file).

    Update from the ESFA – 22 August

    Just to let you know Rob, we’ve found some last-minute issues with the Datamatch report (FM36), so I’m afraid it won’t be available straight away.

    We’re working hard to make it available by lunchtime on Tuesday. Sorry for the inconvenience – we’ll update you as soon as we can.

     
    #390875
    SFA STAFF

    Despite my best efforts I am unable to download FIS. It is absolutely necessary to use it or am I OK to submit my PICS prepared file without FIS?

    Reply from the ESFA

    Hi Gaynor,

    Sorry to hear you’re having trouble.

    You absolutely DO NOT have to use FIS before submitting your file. In a way, it’s better to use Submit Learner Data itself as it does everything that FIS does, plus it uses up-to-date reference data (FIS uses a snapshot taken when FIS was updated). This means your validation report is more accurate in Submit Learner Data.

    We’ve maintained FIS as many providers have told us how they prefer to refine their file using it, for a variety of reasons. If you’re still keen to try FIS out, please try to download the 19/20 version tomorrow. We’ve tested it thoroughly and are confident it should work with all the popular operating systems. If you still have trouble, let us know and we’ll see if there’s anything else we can do.

     
    #390886
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